[300042Z.OH 04/28/96] PAGE 1 UNCLASSIFIED TOR: 09:11 Z 9/2/93 VZCZCBT0106 RR RUEHBT DE RUHQSGG #6643 2420013 ZNR UUUUU R 300042Z AUG 93 ZYB FM CDR JTF-FA HONOLULU HI//J2// TO RUEKJCS/SECDEF WASHINGTON DC//USDP:RSA// INFO RHEHNSC/WHITE HOUSE NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL WASH DC:. RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHINGTON DC//CA/EAP/VLC/CCS/OCS// RUEKJCS/JOINT STAFF WASHINGTON DC//OCJCS/J5/PW-MIA/J3-JOD// RUHQHQB/USCINCPAC HONOLULU HI//J3/J30-M// RUEKJCS/USCINCPAC LO WASHINGTON DC RUEAIIA/CIA WASHINGTON DC//DEA/SEA/IB/DDO/EA/ICOG// RUHVAAA/CDRUSACILHI HICKAM AFB HI//TAPC-PED-H// RUEHBT/USDAO BANGKOK TM//PW-MIA// RUEHBT/CJTFFA DET ONE BANGKOK TH BT UNCLAS //N03460// SECTION O1 OF 02 MSGID/GENADMIN/CDR JTF-FA/J223// SUBJ/INTERVIEW OF REQUESTED SOURCE, TRAN DO// REF/A/FAX/DET 2/16MAY93// AMPN/SUBJ: LIST OF PERSONS FOR INTERVIEW, ENTRY NUMBER 44 OF 83// RMKS/1. BACKGROUND. ON 21 AUG 1993, A JOINT U.S./VIETNAM ORAL PAGE 02 RUHQSGG6643 UNCLAS HISTORY PROGRAM INTERVIEW TEAM INTERVIEWED RETIRED MAJOR GENERAL (MG) TRAN DO, AN OVER 70 YEAR OLD HANOI RESIDENT. MR. DO IS THE FORMER HEAD OF THE B2 FRONT POLITICAL DEPARTMENT. THE TEAM MET AT THE ANTE-BUILDING MEETING ROOM OF THE GOVERNMENT GUEST HOUSE, 2 LE THACH STREET, HOAN KIEM DISTRICT, HANOI, TO INTERVIEW MR. DO, LISTED IN REFERENCE AS A POTENTIAL SOURCE OF INFORMATION CONCERNING U.S. PERSONNEL MISSING IN ACTION (MIA) IN VIETNAM. THE U.S. CONTINGENT CONSISTED OF MR. KEITH GARY FLANAGAN , DET 2, JOINT TASK FORCE-FULL ACCOUNTING (JTF-FA) CASUALTY RESOLUTION SPECIALIST ; AND P02 JOHN HARVEY, JTF-FA ANALYST/LINGUIST. THE VIETNAMESE CONTINGENT CONSISTED OF LTC LE KY, MINISTRY OF DEFENSE; AND MR. NGUYEN THANH LOI, MINISTRY OF INTERIOR. TRAN DO HAD NOT BEEN INTERVIEWED BY A JOINT TEAM BEFORE. 2. SUMMARY . THE SOURCE, TRAN DO, PROVIDED NO INFORMATI ON RELATING TO U.S. LOSS INCIDENTS IN VIETNAM. HE EXPRESSED HIS REGRET THAT HE IS UNABLE TO ASSIST THE JOINT TEAM DUE TO HIS POOR MEMORY. HE EXPRESSED HIS UNDERSTANDING OF THE PW/MIA ISSUE. MR. DO CLAIMED NO KNOWLEDGE OF U.S. PERSONNEL, LIVING FREELY OR AGAINST THEIR WILL, IN VIETNAM SINCE 1973. 3. DETAILS. PAGE 03 RUHQSGG6643 UNCLAS A. AFTER FORMAL INTRODUCTIONS, LTC LE KY EXPLAINED THE JOINT TEAM'S MISSION AND MR. FLANAGAN BEGAN THE INTERVIEW BY ASKING MR. DO TO SHARE ANY INFORMATION HE HAS CONCERNING U. S. PERSONNEL UNCLASSIFIED PAGE 2 UNCLASSIFIED TOR: 09:11 Z 9/2/93 LOST DURING THE WAR AGAINST AMERICA. MR. DO BEGAN BY STATING THAT HE LEFT THE B2 FRONT, WHERE HE SERVED PRIMARILY AS A COMBAT COMMANDER AND POLITICAL OFFICER, IN 1975. HE SAID THAT SINCE LEAVING B2 FRONT HE HAS BEEN IN CHARGE OF CULTURAL MATTERS IN VIETNAM AND REMEMBERS VERY LITTLE ABOUT THE WAR AGAINST AMERICA. HE ADMITTED THAT HE DID HAVE A HIGH POSITION IN THE B2 FRONT, BUT DUE TO HIS AGE AND FAILING MEMORY HE NOW CANNOT REMEMBER ANYTHING THAT WENT ON THERE MR. DO STRESSED THAT HE NEVER HAD ANY DIRECT DEALINGS WITH U.S. PRISONERS OF WAR (PW) AND HAS NO INFORMATION WHICH WILL HELP THE JOINT TEAM RESOLVE ANY SPECIFIC LOSS INCIDENTS. B. MR. DO SAID THAT IT SINCERELY BOTHERS HIM THAT HE CANNOT PROVIDE THE TEAM WITH SPECIFIC NAMES, LOCATION OF DOCUMENTS, OR CIRCUMSTANCES OF LOSS CONCERNING U.S. SERVICEMEN LOST IN THE WAR. HE SAID THAT DURING THE WAR HIS PRIMARY ADVERSARIES WERE ARMY OF, THE REPUBLIC OF VIETNAM (ARVN) FORCES. THE ARVN FOUGHT THE GROUND WAR AND THE U.S. FOUGHT THE AIR WAR, HE SAID. PAGE 04 RUHQSGG6643 UNCLAS C. HE SAID THAT DUE TO RAPID U.S. BATTLEFIELD RESPONSE TIMES AND DEVASTATING AIR ATTACKS, IT WAS ROUTINE FOR PEOPLE'S ARMY OF VIETNAM (PAVN) UNITS TO LEAVE WOUNDED U.S. SOLDIERS ON THE BATTLEFIELD. THERE WERE NO DETENTION CAMPS, MEDICAL FACILITIES, OR PAVN BASES, HE SAID. EVERYTHING HE SAID, HAD TO BE VERY MOBILE AND ONLY THOSE CADRE WHO WERE DIRECTLY INVOLVED WITH DETAINING A SPECIFIC PRISONER, SUCH AS ENEMY PROSELYTING CADRE, WOULD HAVE ANY INFORMATION ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED TO A PRISONER. D. MR. FLANAGAN ASKED MR. DO IF SINCE 1973, HE HAS HAD KNOWLEDGE OF U.S. PW'S OR "STAY-BEHINDS" IN VIETNAM. MR. DO SAID THAT HE IS VERY AWARE OF BOTH OF THESE ISSUES, BUT HAS NO KNOWLEDGE OF EITHER PW'S OR U.S. "STAY-BEHINDS" SINCE 1973, ADDING THE HE HAS ALSO CONSIDERED THAT THE NUMEROUS EUROPEANS LIVING IN VIETNAM HAVE ADDED TO RUMORS ABOUT U.S. "STAY-BEllINDS". HE SAID THAT HE HAS SPENT MUCH TIME PONDERING WHERE SUCH IDEAS COULD COME FROM. FOLLOWING THE WAR WITH FRANCE, HE SAID, THERE WERE MANY "STAY-BEHINDS" IN VIETNAM, BUT FOLLOWING THE WAR WITH AMERICA THERE WERE NONE. HE RECALLED HEARING STORIES OF U.S. PW'S AND "STAY-BEHINDS", BUT THESE ARE ONLY STORIES, HE SAID WHICH HAVE NO CREDIBILITY. MR. DO OPINED THAT THE CAUSE OF THE PAGE 05 RUHQSGG6643 UNCLAS SUSPICIONS IS A GENERAL LACK OF UNDERSTANDING OF THE VIETNAMESE PEOPLE AND CULTURE ON THE PART OF THE AMERICANS. THERE ARE MANY MORE VIETNAMESE MISSING FROM THE WAR THEN AMERICANS, HE SAID. THE VIETNAMESE MIA PROBLEM HAS CREATED DIFFICULTIES IN VIETNAM, HE SAID, AND HE CANNOT UNDERSTAND WHY THE AMERICANS QUESTION THE VIETNAMESE PEOPLE'S CONSIDERATION OF THIS ISSUE. MR. DO SAID THAT IT APPEARS THE U.S. IS CONTINUING TO PURSUE ANSWERS WHICH CANNOT BE ANSWERED BECAUSE THE QUESTIONS ARE BASED ON FALSE ASSUMPTIONS. MR. DO ALSO REFERENCED THE TRAN VAN QUANG (TRAANF VAWN QUANG) "RUSSIAN DOCUMENT". HE SAID THAT THE U. S. SHOULD UNCLASSIFIED PAGE 3 UNCLASSIFIED TOR: 09:11 Z 9/2/93 OFFICIALLY DENOUNCE THIS DOCUMENT. E. MR. DO SAID THAT HE CAN UNDERSTAND WHY THE VIETNAM WAR IS A MYSTERY TO MANY AMERICANS. HE SAID THAT THE MISINFORMATION CAMPAIGN THE U.S. USED MUST HAVE CREATED CONFUSION FOR AMERICANS. FOR EXAMPLE, HE SAID THAT THE BODY COUNT REPORTS OF KILLED PAVN TROOPS WERE OFTEN RIDICULOUSLY HIGH AND AT TIMES CONSIDERED QUITE HUMOROUS BY HIS MEN, WHILE IN THE WEST THE U.S. WAS REPORTEDLY WINNING THE WAR. HE RECALLED ONE INSTANCE WHEN HE READ A WESTERN PRESS REPORT WHICH SAID ONE OF HIS UNITS WAS ENTIRELY WIPED OUT, AND 15 MINUTES LATER THE ENTIRE UNIT REPORTED FOR DUTY. SIX OR PAGE 06 RUHQSGG6643 3 UNCLAS SEVEN TIMES, HE SAID, HIS OWN DEATH WAS REPORTED BY THE U. S. HE SAID THAT THIS TYPE OF FALSE REPORTING IS WHAT PERPETRATED THE MIA ISSUE. F. MR. DO SUGGESTED THAT THE JOINT TEAM SPEND MORE TIME INTERVIEWING GROUPS OF INDIVIDUALS. HE SAID THAT FROM PERSONAL EXPERIENCE, IT IS EASIER TO REMEMBER THE PAST WHEN IN A GROUP OF FORMER COMRADES. G. WITH NO FURTHER QUESTIONS FOR TRAN DO, THE JOINT TEAM AGREED TO CONCLUDE THE INTERVIEW. 4. CORRELATIONS TO EXISTING POW/MIA CASES. NONE. 5. POTENTIAL LEADS. NONE. 6. MATERIAL EVIDENCE: NONE. THIS SOURCE BROUGHT NO RECORDS NOTEBOOKS, DIARIES, OR ANY MATERIAL EVIDENCE ASSOCIATED WITH UNACCOUNTED FOR U. S. PERSONNEL. 7. COMMENTS. A. MR. DO SEEMED SINCERE IN HIS REMARKS TO THE JOINT TEAM. HE CONTINUOUSLY REMINDED THE JOINT TEAM THAT HE AN OLD MAN WHO HAS A VERY DIFFICULT TIME REMEMBERING THE PAST. HE PERIODICALLY RELATED STORIES TO THE TEAM AS EVIDENCE OF HIS MEMORY FAILURE. // BT #6643 NNNN PAGE 1 UNCLASSIFIED TOR: 09:11 Z 9/2/93 VZCZCBTO105 RR RUEHBT DE RUHQSGG #6644 2420013 ZNR UUUUU R 300042Z AUG 93 ZYB FM CDR JTF-FA HONOLULU HI//J2// TO RUEKJCS/SECDEF WASHINGTON DC//USDP:RSA// INFO RHEHNSC/WHITE HOUSE NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL WASH DC RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHINGTON DC//CA/EAP/VLC/CCS/OCS// RUEKJCS/JOT NT STAFF WASHI NGTON DC//OCJCS /J5/ PW-MIA/ J3 -JOD// RUHQHQB/ USCINCPAC HONOLULU HI//J3/J30-M// RUEKJCS/USCINCPAC LO WASHINGTON DC RUEAI IA/CIA WASHINGTON DC//DEA/SEA/IB/DDO/EA/ICOG// RUHVAAA/CDRUSACILHI HICKAM AFB HI//TAPC-PED-II// RUEHBT/USDAO BANGKOK TM//PW-MIA// RUEHBT/CJTFFA DET ONE BANGKOK TH BT UNCLAS //N03460// FINAL SECTION OF 02 MSGID/GENADMIN/CDR JTF-FA/J2 2 3/ / SUBJ/INTERVIEW OF REQUESTED SOURCE TRAN DO// RMKS/ THE MOST SIGNIFICANT OF WHICH WAS A STORY ABOUT READING A HISTORY BOOK WHICH MENTIONED A FAMOUS BATTLE THAT HE HAD PARTICIPATED IN. PAGE 02 RUHQSGG6644 UNCLAS HE SAID THAT EVEN THOUGH HE KNEW HE WAS PRIMARY PARTICIPANT, HE COULD NOT REMEMBER THE BATTLE. B. MR. DO ALSO RELATED SITUATIONS TO THE JOINT TEAM AS EVIDENCE AS TO WHY THE MIA PROBLEM IS GREATER FOR THE VIETNAMESE PEOPLE THAN IT IS FOR THE AMERICANS, WHILE EMPHASIZING THAT THE VIETNAMESE ARE CONCERNED WITH U. S. MIA MATTERS. C. THE MEMBERS OF THE JOINT TEAM CONFERRED ON THE QUESTIONS TO BE ASKED DURING THIS INTERVIEW. TEAM MEMBERS AGREED THAT THE NEED TO REINTERVIEW THIS SUBJECT. WOULD DEPEND ON WHETHER FURTHER QUESTIONS FOR MR. DO ARISE DURING THE COURSE OF THE ORAL HISTORY TEAM'S FUTURE WORK. D. REQUEST THE VNOSMP MAKE TRAN DO AVAILABLE FOR REINTERVIEW IF NECESSARY.// BT #6644 NNNN UNCLASSIFIED